By: @ameliaismore
Fo those women who are or aspire to be in the music and/or entertainment industry you will want to read this article. The phenomenal woman in this article, continues to help women at #BlackGirlTalkNY; consulting, navigating growing their business. Clients spanning a multitude of industries; doing; done and re-branding; or desire to do business. What has she done? In the 90’s, there were women breaking ground for women in the entertainment business. They were; “doing it!” and continue to do it. She will tell you it takes; spirituality, resilience, persistence, confidence, know-how and prowess to successfully grow your business. Our next guest continues to do it as…. The Phenomenal Woman!
Amelia: Welcome to UBCTV Listening Room; Penny Saintil aka MsPennyPR! I am so happy to be doing this interview. Let’s get straight to it. Your journey from a petal to a rose, let’s talk about the journey to become a phenomenal woman. I think your story depicts what tenacity, spiritualism, drive, persistence and understanding the power of networking really reflects. An example of how today’s women support other women. With that said if you had to define yourself, who is Ms. Penny? What is that definition?
MsPennypr: A go getter. A non-stopper… just an all-around person whose faith took over her belief and understanding in the power of love, understanding, forgiveness, friendship, and her community. Knowing that she is a woman who always wanted to be someone who you could come and talk to regardless of that fact if they were having a good day or a bad day. An all-around good person.
Amelia: I want to take you back to the very beginning because people don’t understand that self-evolution is really a process. So, I would like you to talk about when you first said to yourself, I’m going to get into the entertainment industry.
MsPennypr: Well, I was already in the entertainment business because I was bartending at the Player’s Club in the Bronx. There I met Ray Daniels. Ray saw me hustling at the bar. At the bar you had to hustle to get guys to buy drinks. When he saw me doing my thing he said, “You got that niche.” I was like, “Nah I just like what I do and the more drinks I make, the more they tip me, the more money I make.” Then he asked me if I could work for him. He had a magazine Drama Magazine. All I had to do was sell magazines. So, I decided to try it out. Funny thing was, I already knew a few celebrities like AZ and others. I got them on the cover of his magazine.
Next, I met Shampoo. He told me that he liked my swag and hustle as well. He asked me if I could come work with him because he worked for Def Jam. He told me he also had YNVS and worked with other labels too. So, I was like alright cool. I ended up working for Shampoo. At that time, Ray Daniels was moving to Atlanta. While Ray moved to Atlanta I winded up working for Shampoo.
Working for him I became his assistant and then his administrative assistant. I was part of the street team. First, I was working in the streets with the street team and then I started working inside the events with Shampoo. I would do all the parties for the labels and started making connections with people from the labels. Then Shampoo started doing his own parties and I started doing parties with Shampoo and then after a while I felt like it was time for me to branch out and do my own thing.
I felt like now that I had perfected my craft, now I could be my own woman. I didn’t need to work for anyone else. That’s when I created Music Speaks Power. That name came about because I love music, I knew I had the power and I love to talk, so it became Music Speaks Power. It also was the initials of my name MS. Penny. As MSP I started working with the Force MD’s, Ice T, Rick Ross with his WingStop on 125th Street. I worked with a lot of folks. I also worked with unsigned artist. I noticed that unsigned and underground artist weren’t getting the attention they needed to help them get signed. I wanted to help them be the next big artist. At the same time, I started working with Melissa Lebron who had her own Nascar team. I was expanding into everything.
Amelia: During that time were you also going to school for Public Relations?
MsPennypr: Yes, I was. I felt like you don’t want to go into this business and not have a degree. Some people can do it, but I felt like I needed to know certain things. I felt like if I’m going to tell someone I can do It I needed to show them I can do it. So, I got my degree from Long Island University. After I got my degree, I felt like I needed to do more especially for women in the industry because we weren’t getting the recognition we deserved. I started to figure out a way to help the other young PR girls coming into the industry. Even if they didn’t give me the recognition for helping them, I felt like they are the next generation and as long as I saw them shinning that was good enough for me. I didn’t really have that help so if I can help other women avoid some of the challenges I faced and get to that next level that to me I feel is a blessing. I also learned about having a game face. What people didn’t know was during that time I was going through a lot. I was going through relationships issues with domestic violence. I didn’t want anyone to know that I was going through that, so I kept working. It wasn’t even that I was making crazy money doing pr. It’s just something I love to do. I’ve learned that I am that person, the one who wants to help somebody fulfill their dreams in the industry.
Amelia: Is that when you started Black Girls Talk NY?
MsPennypr: No, I started the Black Girls Talk NY during the pandemic. When we got locked down, we couldn’t see each other, and it was hard to stay in contact with each other. We usually go out to have brunch and stuff like that we couldn’t do anymore. I really started it with a young lady named Janine Smith, but Ms. Janine decided that she didn’t want to be a part of it and wanted to do her own thang. It was supposed to be two females creating something amazing, but I guess one did not believe in the cause. That’s ok. At the end of the day, you don’t need somebody to give you inspiration for what you believe in. I believed that Black Girls Talk NY would be a success regardless of who was going to be a part of it and who would not. I also did not want to make this all about celebrities because to me a regular female who works a 9-5 is a phenomenal woman. A woman around the corner is a phenomenal woman. A woman who gets up everyday to take care of her children is a phenomenal woman. I wanted this to be about everyday women, doing their everyday things while being a phenomenal woman. That’s why I created the event Phenomenal Women. All the women that night were celebrities in their own right!
Amelia: Beautiful! I want to take you back again because a lot of people both men and women don’t understand what it means to be a woman in the entertainment business. I would like for you to talk a little about that and in your discussion give us insight in what you told yourself to persevere. Many times, men in the business will push you, challenge you, ignore you, ridicule you, steal your ideas, the list goes on… What kept you going despite all of that?
MsPennypr: It was hard! This industry is a male dominated business. So, I had to be a woman but act like a man. I had to play my position to get to where I wanted to be. I never tried to be fake with anybody. I always tried to remain grounded in who I was and that’s where my faith came in. I had to know who I was as a person regardless if I did not have this certain situation in my life. Once I realized who I was as a woman and first as a woman of God, it came out naturally. It was hard. I had people talk about me, people deny me and people who shun me. I had people who took my ideas or my creativity and did their own thing and try to copycat me, but I feel like this whole world is a copycat. (laughter) You do one trend and then someone does the same thing another way. This industry is definitely a male dominated industry. One thing I’m proud of is that I never slept my way to the top. Maybe that’s why I’m mediocre. (laughter) Some of these women in the industry had to sleep their way to the top. That’s their preference. However, that only lasts for a little while. I’ve seen people come and go. Yet at the end of the day my name still rings bells. Like, “Oh you don’t know Ms. Penny? Well then you don’t know the industry.” I know folks that say that to people. (laughter) Like I said, I have seen people come and go and I don’t know where they are at, yet Ms. Penny is still here.
Amelia: I want to give everybody men and women the understanding of what it was like then verses now. Because there were people like yourself that made executives understand that girls can do the same job. It’s like you opened doors for other women to follow. During the 90’s there weren’t’ many women on street teams doing street promotion. I remember when I was going for an Asst A&R job and I was watching guys go in to interview for the job that I was already doing as a temp for a few months. It was just an unwritten understanding that those positions were for men not women. Until we along with others proved otherwise.
MsPennypr: They think that we’re gonna get pregnant, we’re gonna take days off, we’re gonna get in a relationship and then we won’t be focused. It was always a negative stereotype on the women in the music industry despite a Sylvia Rhone who at the time was killing the game. Yet at the end of the day women have proved that they can raise a family, take care of the household, and maintain our job at the same time. What’s messed up is that regardless, the men are always going to feel like you are lacking in something even though you are handling everything. So, you have to know your truth. The double standard is the men feel like they can do everything. They can sleep with 100 women, go to work, hang out, maintain a household, and still win. (laughter)
Amelia: You know a great mentor of mine, Faith Hope Consolo (RIP) said it the best; “As women in business, you can have it all and do everything, just not all at the same time. Balance is the most important thing so that you can execute everything and not lose your sanity.”
Amelia: So that is my next question. How did you maintain through all the mayhem? I watched you work those doors, I watched you move those artists. I watched you Ms. Penny and your hustle. How do you maintain your sanity during insane situations?
MsPennypr: God! I had a woman who was in my life who was a spiritual woman, and her name is Dr. Rita L Speller from Far Rockway. She’s a pastor and she always kept me grounded during the process of becoming a phenomenal woman. I could always talk to her. Regardless of the fact that I have a Mom. Yes, I have a mother, but Dr. Speller became that mother that gave me nurturing mother love. My mother has always been in politics all her life. She was the head nurse of Mount Saini Hospital. She worked at Terrence Carter Cook Health Care Center working with disabled children. Then when she retired, she became a Republican for the Haitian American Caucus. She was recruiting Hattians to become republicans. I didn’t want to be a part of the political world.
Amelia: There is a lot to be said about answering your call. Do you feel that God has called you to be an instrument of empowerment? What do you say to the other ladies who are inspired by you who want to take the baton that you have been running with and pass it forward?
MsPennypr: I just say be true to yourself. I’m glad to pass the baton. I love to see women win. Just be certain to remember those that helped you and give them the recognition for the help they gave you. Don’t make it like you did it all yourself. That helps no one. Nowadays, a lot of women don’t want to give other women the credit of how they helped them through the process to make them what they have become in the industry. The journey is just as important as the results.
Amelia: I agree and now that I am dealing with so many women in doing what I’m doing for female empowerment. I have learned that a lot of women don’t do it because they have never been taught that it’s the right thing to do. I love to tell women you are only as good as who knows how good you are. So, if you truly want to empower each other say their names. I shout out my mentors all the time. It’s important.
MsPennypr: That’s the main reason why I always shout out Shampoo. Ray Daniels might have opened the door, but Shampoo showed me the way. During the process of who I became in the industry it was Shampoo that showed me how to maneuver within the industry. Shampoo showed me how to become a person in the industry and still maintain your respect. He showed me the man’s version. Then I just incorporated that into my woman’s version.
Amelia: Good point. Let’s talk about that differential because I saw it when I transitioned from one of the boys to the sister’s network. Dealing with so many men I felt there was a knowledge, women coming into the industry should know to prohibit them making some mistakes like, falling into the traps, the manipulation, the word play, the set ups and so on. What do you feel outside of knowing your integrity are the lessons not being told that women should know coming into music/entertainment business?
MsPennypr: They need to know the artist for the artist themselves. The people that just get the quick dollar ain’t for you. All money ain’t good money. I don’t believe that everybody should be working with everybody. I think everybody should be honest with the artist they are working with as a client. If they feel that artist is not at a certain level that they want to be at they should be honest with them. Nowadays they are not teaching artist development. They just want to take them and put them on a red carpet, yet the artist doesn’t know how to do public speaking. They don’t know how to walk the red carpet. They don’t know how to pose or talk on the red carpet. There really isn’t a lot of artist development in this industry anymore. This is the reason why I created Black Girls Talk NY. Its a platform to teach these things and the fact that you must know the person you are working with as your client. You can’t be working with Joe Smo and just because he sounds good, he is going to make you a million dollars. Yet, if Joe Smo don’t know how to talk on the red carpet, he can ruin his career in 2.5 seconds. Then all you get is negative press. If that’s what you are going for good but I’d rather my client have a lasting effect, where you want more. Everybody wants to do public relations, but do you know the real meaning and purpose behind public relations. Do you know how to do contracts? Do you know how to do pitches? Do you know how to write a publication for your client? Does your client have an EPK? Does your client have the right look? Does your client need to get a stylist? Regardless of industry your job is to make certain your client is media ready.
Amelia: Do you think PR has become the artist development department because more artists are independentand that major labels are doing less and less AD leaving it up to their managers?
MsPennypr: Yes, to be honest PR has become almost everything in one: the manager, the assistant, the nurse, the counselor on top of the media coach. Some artists nowadays don’t even know what an ISRC code is and its importance to own one for yourself. They don’t know about a GS1. They don’t know about metadata. They don’t know about MIDEM. They don’t know that there is a website that you don’t have to go through the DJ’s to get your record played. You can put your song up on a site and it goes straight to the program directors by just the click of a button. There are many levels of working with artists that these PR’s don’t know yet need to know to help advance their artist’s career. The reason is because when you put that price on there you got a reason to put that price on there.
Amelia: Whew! Child you are speaking the truth! I also think the most important thing is understanding the timeline. One of the biggest issues I have as a consultant is artist see this cookie cutter example of how PR makes it look like these artists had overnight success. Yet, what too many artist don’t understand is that most artists’ overnight success took a couple of years. Or that one article took six months of pitching because no one wanted to be the first to write about your artist. Or that the artist’s overnight success meant tearing down the whole project and putting it back together so that it made sense to the consumer and industry for them to support that artist. Nor do many understand the importance of building a strong team because the only thing that is pushed publicly is Radio and PR.
MsPennypr: And that’s not good. Many of these artists don’t have their own website. How are you an artist in today’s market and don’t have a website? First of all, you have to have a good team. Each person on that team should know the job that they should be doing. A lot of times I see a group that says they are a team, but no one really knows the roles they are filling. So, nothing really gets done or it doesn’t get done right. Seek professionals that know their business.
Amelia: Agreed, if you are an A&R you should be helping the artist find the producers with the hits and the studios to create a great sound and the engineers that can make that happen. If you are marketing, you should know the strategies to bring your artist to market. If you are promotion you should know the tools and DJ’s that will play your artist record and get them the spins they need to get paid off their music. The list goes on. The problem with not having a professional team is I have seen so many artist get put on hold or what we say shelved because their manager didn’t know how to talk to people. Or, their team didn’t understand the process on how to put out a record. Or, they didn’t meet the delivery deadlines. Or, the team had too many leaders and they don’t stick to the plan the rest of the professionals working with them agreed to do. So now no one knows what they are doing. The result; they do nothing. Ms Penny we can talk about this for hours. I want to thank you for all the information you gave our readers and subscribers today. I know you got them open so how can they contact you?
MsPennypr: You can email me at musicspeakspower@gmail.com for consultation. For PR its mspennypr@gmail.com and if you want to contact me for Black Girls Talk you can contact me at blackgilstalkny@gmail.com. These are the things I want people to understand. First be true to yourself. Be true to your craft. Know who you are and know the people who are on your team. Also understand the movers and shakers within your industry. Its important to know your business. Some people will say you don’t need to know your business, but I feel you do because when the checks come you need to know how much you’re getting and how much you’re not. Lastly know your network because the people you know is your net worth. I don’t know everything, but I do know somebody who knows something that helps me to know what I need to know, or I can pass you over to someone that does know, to help you achieve.
Amelia: Well, thank you so much for this interview. I wish you nothing but continued success. It always makes me feel good to get an email from you or a text from you or even see you out because many of us have shaped this industry and paved the way for others to live their dream life and now its time for us to tell our stories. If anyone doesn’t come away with anything from this interview, they should make sure they speak about those that have helped them along their journey of success because you never know when you may need their help again. Again, thank you for coming to the Listening Room on UBCTV Network because when you listen you learn. Lastly everyone, be certain to spread the word! Subscribe to www.ubctvnetwork.com because UBC’ing US!
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